Hozzászólások

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  ikarus (2006-05-29 18:30:51)

  Łączymy się w bólu We join with You in sorrow and pain...

   
• straphan (2006-05-29 19:06:33)

  Indeed - our condolences... Especially since you guys will have more of that sh*** soon... :(

   
• straphan (2006-05-29 19:08:35)

  P.S.: Could you change the company data for the bus? Simply make the bus as owned from 2006 till 2006 by whatever company tested it in Debrecen (same vehicle numbers, etc.), and then make it owned from 2006 onwards by PKS Grodzisk Mazowiecki. If that sounds too difficult, just tell me which company tested it while it was in Hungary...

   
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  mzk804 (2006-05-29 19:16:35)

  Hey! This Yelch (:P) isn't so bad. PKS has more worse buses :P

   
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  JP (2006-05-29 20:40:34)

  I think that in future they may build a trolleybus with jelcz's body

   
• seba (2006-05-29 21:39:09)

  yeeeah, they hated it and bought it? What for? Interesting reasoning... hehe

   
• torqmatic (2006-05-29 22:53:44)

  Look, the only advantage of these vehicles, that they're cheap... but it don't not mean, that they're good.
  Anyway, not the drivers make the decisions...

   
• straphan (2006-05-29 23:15:48)

  @seba: As if the drivers and passengers make the decisions anywhere... Still, these buses are SHITE, and that's that...

   
• borek (*.hosting.torman.pl) (2006-05-30 12:28:47)

  This bus is good enough for the most people in Poland and Hungary but not for sraphan of course!

   
• straphan (2006-05-30 13:22:25)

  @borek: 'course, mate, 'course it is. Let's just stay where we are, resurrect the IK280, because that was good enough for decades... The M120 hails from a French construction which will be celebrating its 40 birthday in a few years, and you call that GOOD ENOUGH? The only advantage of this bus is that it's cheaper than the competition. Apart from that I fail to find one single advantage it could possibly have over comparable vehicles made and/or sold within the EU. Unfortunately, some public transport decisionmakers in the new EU simply fail to realise, that their countries and municipalities are just too poor to buy low quality products.

   
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  decomposed05 (2006-05-30 13:36:36)

  http://phototrans.eu/2-79352.html - Ikarbus also produces CNG buses

   
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  decomposed05 (2006-05-30 13:37:01)

  Maybe Hajdu next will buy it

   
• seba (2006-05-30 15:06:15)

  Ale piękny ten twój ikarbus, tyłek chyba zerżnęli od O305.
  Straphan, your opinions base on arguments like it's shit - because it's shit. Yes, for some 'old ue' countries it's good, when they 'push' ready-made goods, e.g. buses to 'new-ue', it's normal.

   
• straphan (2006-05-30 19:32:50)

  seba: my arguments are based on my personal experiences with Jelcz products as a passenger, as well as what I can read in the industry press. And none of these reports suggest Jelcz products are cheaper than others precisely because of their worse quality. I view those purchasing these buses as short-sighted, since the relatively cheap initial price of the vehicle will be more than compensated for by the higher maintenance costs and lower availability of the vehicles, as well as the fact, that they will tend to discourage passengers from using public transport - it may very well be that many people in Central-Eastern Europe cannot afford a car yet, however, these numbers are dwindling fast.

   
• seba (2006-05-30 20:48:31)

  But reality revised your theory. Do you know company that was bankrupt beacus of jelcz? I can list firms which buying expensive, great brand turned to margin of bankruptcy.

   
• straphan (2006-05-30 23:51:46)

  Look, I can accept that there are companies, who are in serious need of renewing their rolling stock FAST, and who just do not have enough money to buy anything else (although with connectos about I highly doubt it). I can understand that the M121 is practically the cheapest disabled-access bus available. Nonetheless, if a company has the money to get itself something better it should try to do so.

   
• seba (2006-05-31 15:42:11)

  So, maybe Hajdu Debrecen haven't enough money for LF buses. I dont know much about H.D. then I woludn't judge hajdu's policy on stock. Hajdu Debrecen is national or privete company?

   
• tantus (*.konf.pwr.edu.pl) (2006-06-28 10:37:55)

  @straphan: I must worry you. Most of the companies that turned to Jelcz products in recent years emphasise that their main advantage is LOW MAINTENANCE COSTS, compared with Western designs. It's even more important than the purchase price. Also, Jelcz has made a huge progress in terms of quality in the last few years (implementation of ISO 9001 procedures, use of stainless steel both for the panelling and for the body shell), which - unfortunately - has not really been noticed, because the level of sales by Jelcz has dropped significantly in the same period. So, actually, most of the opinions about Jelcz buses actually refer to vehicles build no earlier than 6-7 years ago, whereas much has changed in these buses since then...

   
• tantus (*.konf.pwr.edu.pl) (2006-06-28 10:44:08)

  Many operators - especially in the new EU countries, but not only - buy large quantities of high- and middle- floor buses, such as MAN SL223 (based on MAN's design from the early 1980s) or MB Conecto (based on MB O.305 design from 1970s). In what way is M120 worse than these models? Is it the independent front suspension or amybe the stainless steel bodywork?? Besides - no one forced HV to buy high-floored buses. They could well by a CNG-powered Vecto (full-length low-floor, designed in late 1990s), which would be even easier, as this bus already exists...

   

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